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Old 04-19-2012, 08:10 AM   #1
radeonized2
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Broadwell, a look in the future;

About two and a half years off is going to be the biggest change in mainboard design. Here's a look in to the future.. Intel Broadwell: goodbye chipset? - Neowin The PC boards will take longer to fully take advantage of this, but I can envision something much smaller than the desktop and servers of today are going to be used in the not too distance future. Might look like something from Star Trek. A hand-held mobile device that if you want to play a game with a bigger screen just plug it into a USB-5? monitor.
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Old 05-12-2012, 10:53 PM   #2
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

I was just reading about that and was going to post in the Ivy Bridge thread but I guess I will post here.
Source
Haswell
Everything IVB has and this:
New Advanced Vector Extensions.
  1. Gather-scatter is a type of memory addressing that often arises when addressing vectors in sparse linear algebra operations. It is the vector-equivalent of register indirect addressing, with gather involving indexed reads and scatter indexed writes. Vector processors have hardware support for gather-scatter operations, providing instructions such as Load Vector Indexed for gather and Store Vector Indexed for scatter.
  2. Bit manipulation is the act of algorithmically manipulating bits or other pieces of data shorter than a word. Programming tasks that require bit manipulation include low-level device control, error detection and correction algorithms, data compression, encryption algorithms, and optimization. For most other tasks, modern programming languages allow the programmer to work directly with abstraction instead of bits that represent those abstractions. Source code that does bit manipulation makes use of the bitwise operations: AND, OR, XOR, NOT, and bit shifts.
  3. FMA3 Support-A fused multiply–add is a floating-point multiply–add operation performed in one step, with a single rounding. That is, where an unfused multiply–add would compute the product bc, round it to N significant bits, add the result to a, and round back to N significant bits, a fused multiply–add would compute the entire sum a+bc to its full precision before rounding the final result down to N significant bits.
New LGA 1150pin socket

Intel Transactional Synchronization Extensions (TSX)-TSX provides two software interfaces for designating code regions for transactional execution. Hardware Lock Elision (HLE) is an instruction prefix-based interface designed to be backward compatible with processors without TSX support. Restricted Transactional Memory (RTM) is a new instruction set interface that provides greater flexibility for programmers. TSX enables optimistic execution of transactional code regions. The hardware monitors multiple threads for conflicting memory accesses and aborts and rolls back transactions that cannot be successfully completed. Mechanisms are provided for software to detect and handle failed transactions.

Direct3D 11.1 and OpenGL 3.2 graphics unit


Expected features
  • 32nm PCH.
  • A new cache desing.
  • support for Thunderbolt technology.
  • There will be three versions of the integrated GPU: GT1, GT2, and GT3. According to vr-zone, the fastest version (GT3) will have 20 execution units (EU). Another source, SemiAccurate, however says that the GT3 will have 40 EUs with an accompanying 64MB cache on an interposer. Haswell's predecessor, Ivy Bridge, has a maximum of 16 Eus.
  • New advanced power-saving system.
  • Base clock (Bclk) increase to 266MHz.
  • 128 bytes cache line.
  • Execution trace cache will be included L2 caching design.
  • Fully integrated voltage regulator, thereby moving another component from the motherboard onto the CPU.
  • 25, 37, 47, 57W TDP mobile processors.
  • 77/65/55/45/35W and ~ 100W+(high-end) TDP desktop processors.
  • 15W TDP processors for the Ultrabook platform (multi-chip package like Westmere.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Then comes Broadwell, a 14nm die-shrink of Haswell. Broadwell will adopt the Multi-Chip Package (MCP) design. This could mean that Haswell motherboards might not be compatible with Broadwell motherboards (as Haswell's chipset is still external).

Then comes the new tock Skylake architecture. Skylake will be 14nm and have mainstream support for DDR4 memory.

Then comes Skymont, the 10nm tick of Skylake.

Around Broadwell I heard a grain-of-salt statement that Intel will not have PCI graphics card support from the CPU. It looks to me like Haswell might be a pretty good processor but it to will be a dead end because Broadwell eliminates the final chip in the chipset. Also it looks like Broadwell will be a dead end (not the socket) because Skylake starts using DDR4 which is totally different from DDR3. It will be a mess going forward and I don't see how Intel will inject the Extreme mainboards/CPU's which need to last a while. Knowing this information going forward should help you decide when you want to upgrade.
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Old 05-13-2012, 09:46 AM   #3
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Thanks for the info Sandog.
So, it looks like Ivy Bridge / Haswell is the last of the CPU/chipset type PC as we have known it for many years.
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Old 05-13-2012, 12:06 PM   #4
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Quote:
Originally Posted by PeterT View Post
Thanks for the info Sandog.
So, it looks like Ivy Bridge / Haswell is the last of the CPU/chipset type PC as we have known it for many years.
Yeah, Broadwell will make the desktop death knell even closer if it happens because the mobo can be made so small and less power hungry. Also the Haswell PCH will be 32nm and I would say probably could get by without a heatsink. Haswell has some nice features that almost make it waitable but the thing is the Haswell chipset should also feature full SATA III and USB 3.0 support and probably Thunderbolt although I don't see those devices taking hold for a while. If it was known that Haswell would OC very high like Sandy Bridge then I would definitely wait. There will be multiple versions of Haswell that differentiate by GPU performance. The slower GPU models might be the OC ones but it is too early to know what Haswell will OC like.
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Old 05-13-2012, 02:21 PM   #5
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Thanks rad, Sandog for the info, yep the pc as we know it will soon be
only a memory. As the song says: Captain Jack the times they are a changing...
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Old 05-13-2012, 02:30 PM   #6
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Haswell will have a +100W desktop CPU version. That will be the one with the extra GPU cache and possibly more than quad core.
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Old 05-13-2012, 02:45 PM   #7
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sandog View Post
Haswell will have a +100W desktop CPU version. That will be the one with the extra GPU cache and possibly more than quad core.
Sounds good I just hope it doesn't disappoint like IVB has with oc'ing...
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Old 05-13-2012, 02:53 PM   #8
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

I really don't think it will be much different. Intel will probably have tweaked the architecture a bit and maybe gone back to using the old TIM plus the die process might be more refined but Intel will be adding more transistors. The OCing of IVB is not a big deal to me anymore, 4.5GHz without a voltage tweak would probably suit me and it would be cool on my water loop. Some of the Haswell features are better and the chipset will be better because of full SATA III support. I think the GPU in IVB would already be adequate for me me as long as it will display Windows. I don't need the GPU to get more powerful as I intend to use a discrete graphics card.

One thing Skully that might help Haswell with OCing is the Bclk can now go to 266MHz. Also from above the CPU voltage regulator might be present inside Haswell. This would create more heat as well.
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Old 05-13-2012, 04:46 PM   #9
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Just back from a walk in the park after a nice rain. I saw 4 hawks quite a
sight. One flew low over my head, gliding on the air currents...

Yes the Bclk going up to 266mhz, I would think would help with oc'ing. I
can also live with a 4500 oc. But I sure would have liked a stable 5gig oc with
IVB. I still not sure what I'll do, as this system is more then ample for my needs.
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Old 05-13-2012, 05:02 PM   #10
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Re: Broadwell, a look in the future;

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sir Skully View Post
Just back from a walk in the park after a nice rain. I saw 4 hawks quite a
sight. One flew low over my head, gliding on the air currents...

Yes the Bclk going up to 266mhz, I would think would help with oc'ing. I
can also live with a 4500 oc. But I sure would have liked a stable 5gig oc with
IVB. I still not sure what I'll do, as this system is more then ample for my needs.
I went to Savage Gulf, TN last weekend and enjoyed an overnight camping trip. I saw turkey buzzards circling in the air currents from atop the mountains. Pretty cool.

Yeah Skully, you could definitely wait and see if IVB-E arrives next year which it probably will and you will have all the benefits of it. By that time Intel might have made a much better chip. I don't know if current IVB will do 5GHz. Apparently it takes a lot more volts and the heat goes way up. Even those who have water cooling setups like we do can't stave off the heat under high OC's.
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